Connects Refund!

[dangol_dipen]

Hi,

I have noticed that a lot of jobs I applied to were closed without hiring anyone, and still, I didn't got my connects back. Is this normal in my case?

Regards

[petra_r]

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Sohit D wrote:

I have noticed that a lot of jobs I applied to were closed without hiring anyone, and still, I didn't got my connects back. Is this normal in my case?

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If a job post expires (30 days inactivity) you currently don't get your connects back

[dangol_dipen]

No, I am pretty sure they interviewed freelancers but didn't hire anyone. It didn't expired in 30 days.

[slavkoa · Accepted solution]

Connect are getting back only in two case :

1. Client close contract.
2. Validation of ToS.

All others cases connect are lost:

1. You got hired.
2. Some one else is hired.
3. Job expired.
3. No one is hired.

click here for more info

[ffc35874]

Now, I also agree to the concept of not refunding the connects under below conditions.  Thanks for sharing the info.

1. You got hired.
2. Some one else is hired.
3. Job expired.
3. No one is hired.

[petra_r]

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Sohit D wrote:

No, I am pretty sure they interviewed freelancers but didn't hire anyone. It didn't expired in 30 days.

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It does not matter whether they interviewed people or not. When job posts expire, connects are not returned.

[charlenesalvador]

Hi, Petra thank you for these head-ups.

But I think its time for Upwork to make sure that all Job post the client will hire someone because if they post a vacant Job but will not hire someone until the job post expire then the Freelancer will waste the Connect in applying on that job post and also at least they are payment verified also before doing the job post.

[petra_r]

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charlene s wrote:

But I think its time for Upwork to make sure that all Job post the client will hire someone.

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That's like every shop you walk into forcing you to buy something. Would you ever go back into a shop that did that? You can see a client's hire rate on their job posts, so you can see if clients regularly hire. 

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[geri_kol]

True, Upwork cannot and should not *force* clients to hire, but likewise they should not *force* freelancers to gamble spending Connects on jobs that eventually don't hire. And since it cannot be known in advance whether a client will hire or not (they may very well have legitimate reasons not to, e.g. they don´t find a suitable freelancer), the reciprocally right thing to do is to refund Connects in cases clients end up not hiring. 

[feed_my_eyes]

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Gergana K wrote:

True, Upwork cannot and should not *force* clients to hire, but likewise they should not *force* freelancers to gamble spending Connects on jobs that eventually don't hire. 

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They don't force us - you can choose whether you want to bid on a job or not.

[geri_kol]

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They don't force us - you can choose whether you want to bid on a job or not.

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I am fully aware they don´t actually force us to apply, Christine - but the way the Connects system is designed in effect makes it so that when freelancers do apply for a job, they are forced to gamble on the chance that anyone at all will be hired. I don´t know of a real-life situation where a job-seeker or a freelancer is expected to pay money to apply for a job that doesn´t actually exist or that ends up hiring from elsewhere. Since Upwork is a "pay to play" platform, if clients don´t hire from the platform while posting ads and attracting paid bids on the platform, Connects should unequivocally be returned.

[feed_my_eyes]

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Gergana K wrote:

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They don't force us - you can choose whether you want to bid on a job or not.

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I am fully aware they don´t actually force us to apply, Christine - but the way the Connects system is designed in effect makes it so that when freelancers do apply for a job, they are forced to gamble on the chance that anyone at all will be hired. I don´t know of a real-life situation where a job-seeker or a freelancer is expected to pay money to apply for a job that doesn´t actually exist or that ends up hiring from elsewhere. Since Upwork is a "pay to play" platform, if clients don´t hire from the platform while posting ads and attracting paid bids on the platform, Connects should unequivocally be returned.

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Anyone who runs a business is forced to "gamble" all the time. Other kinds of businesses have to take out ads, print posters, spend money on PR - all of these are gambles with no guarantee that it will bring them customers. Even when you search for a job in a traditional way, you need to spend money on transportation and/or parking to go to an interview, with no guarantee that you'll get the job.

Placing bids on Upwork is one of the cheapest forms of marketing in existance - even if it doesn't pay off every time - but people still aren't satisfied and expect it to be completely free. (Anyway, connects basically ARE free now, with Upwork handing out 80 connects for answering questions, 10 free connects per month, and 10 more every time you're interviewed. Anyone with a moderate degree of competence won't have to pay for connects.)

[petra_r]

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Christine A wrote:

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Anyone with a moderate degree of competence won't have to pay for connects.)

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And those that still have to buy connects are likely the unprofitable ones Upwork doesn't want anyway. Next step may want to be to sharply raise the price of connects....

[geri_kol]

Think of Upwork´s current connects policy as a slot machine: you put in coins for the relatively low probability of winning and you never get your coins back, unless there is a technical issue with the machine (i.e. terms-of-service violation or client proactively closes the contract). "The house never loses," as they say in the casino gaming world. 

[moonraker]

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Gergana K wrote:

Think of Upwork´s current connects policy as a slot machine: you put in coins for the relatively low probability of winning and you never get your coins back, unless there is a technical issue with the machine (i.e. terms-of-service violation or client proactively closes the contract). "The house never loses," as they say in the casino gaming world. 

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Speak for yourself. 

I don't get jobs on blind luck. I get jobs because I work hard and have the appropriate skills. I'm also smart enough to avoid those jobs that have low hiring rates... 

[petra_r]

To be honest, we have reached the point where we are just going in circles and Gergana and us will simply have to agree to disagree. It's the same argmuments again, none of them on either side get and more or less valid.

At the end of the day, things are as they are. Take it or leave it and that's where we are.

[geri_kol]

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Jamie F wrote:

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Gergana K wrote:

Think of Upwork´s current connects policy as a slot machine: you put in coins for the relatively low probability of winning and you never get your coins back, unless there is a technical issue with the machine (i.e. terms-of-service violation or client proactively closes the contract). "The house never loses," as they say in the casino gaming world. 

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Speak for yourself. 

I don't get jobs on blind luck. I get jobs because I work hard and have the appropriate skills. I'm also smart enough to avoid those jobs that have low hiring rates... 

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Well, I do speak for myself. And no need to beat yourself in the chest and tell us how smart you are, Jamie... I am a top rated freelancer with 100% rating myself and haven´t needed to apply for jobs in at least two months, so personally Upwork´s connects policy does not affect me much, whichever way it swings. This however does not blind me to how flawed and lopsided it was before the most recent changes (note that the original question, which my comment was addressing, was posted before those changes).

[banerjee-s]

Thank you for bringing up the matter.

I have faced a similar issue.

After carrying out detailed sample work, I applied for a project. 

Within 10 mins of the post, the job disappeared and I received a mail, with the header "A job you submitted a proposal for was closed " inside there is a mail saying ...."This job was not in compliance with our Terms of Service"........

But I applied with 4 connects which I have not yet received back. 

At least there must some protection for beginners?

Regards Soumendra

[PradeepH]

Hello Soumendra,

I can see that your connects for the cancelled job post is already refunded. You can check your Connects history page for more information.

Thank you.

Pradeep H.