Solved: Subcontracting?

rendr · ‎12-14-2017

Im currently workng on my first contract here on upwrk and the client im working with seems to have a freelancer account as well and is accepting work and then pushing onto other people.

The original job posting:

**Edited for Community Guidelines**

He is treating me extremly poorly Ive done alot of work for him already and hes is being stubborn

about paying milestones.

The original job has a budget of 500$ but the offer I accepted from him is $1,500

He makes me remove all of my information from the title blocks and wont accept my work unless it has his name down as the author of the work.

I completed half of the work now to only recieve $50.

he said he cant pay me in full until I complete the other half of the work.

Should I go on?

Is there any way i can contact the original job poster?

kat303 · ‎12-14-2017

@Brenden H wrote:
Im currently workng on my first contract here on upwrk and the client im working with seems to have a freelancer account as well and is accepting work and then pushing onto other people.

A person can have both a freelancer account and a client account on this site. As long as the freelancer makes that known to the client AND the client is ok with that, then subcontracting out work is fine.

The original job posting:
**Edited for Community Guidelines**

He is treating me extremly poorly Ive done alot of work for him already and hes is being stubborn about paying milestones.

When a client starts to be very difficult and it's a big hassle for them to fund escrow, then it may be time for the freelancer to terminate the contract and move on. A freelancer (as well as a client) is not obligated to continue to work with either (client/freelancer)

The original job has a budget of 500$ but the offer I accepted from him is $1,500

He makes me remove all of my information from the title blocks and wont accept my work unless it has his name down as the author of the work.

Once a client pays for the job, the content is theirs and they can do whatever they want to with it. If you wanted your name to appear anywhere, that should have been included in the contract and agreed on by the client.

I completed half of the work now to only recieve $50.

Be VERY careful on what this client is doing. If you completed half of the work then you should have been paid half of the agreed amount - $750. And the client must fund escrow for the agreed on amount otherwise, you do NOT start work until they do. It doesn't matter what the agreed on price of this job was, you will only get paid what is in escrow.
If you do the rest of the work, and the client doesn't fund the remaining amount, then you get paid, Nothing. In this case, so far you've only received $50 but have done $750 work of work. What will you do, if you do the rest of the work and then the client disappears without paying you anything more?
Escrow is offered on this site as protection in case the above happens. At this point, the client needs to pay the remaining 1/2 amount since you've done 1/2 of the job, AND this client needs to fund the rest of the amount BEFORE you do ANY more work. If you don't follow that advice, your next post here will be " I've finished the job but I've only been paid $50. How do I get the rest of my money."
he said he cant pay me in full until I complete the other half of the work.

Should I go on?
NO, do NOT continue no matter what the client says. You need to be paid the remaining amount for the 1st milestone, AND the client needs to fund the remaining balance into escrow. Until that is done, stop working. (see above reply)

Is there any way i can contact the original job poster?
The only way you can contact the client is the way you've been contacting them before.

View solution in original post

katrinabeaver · ‎12-14-2017

You should not go on until the next milestone is funded, and only turn in that milestone.

"Fairness is giving all people the treatment they earn and deserve. It doesn't mean treating everyone alike-Coach John Wooden"

nkocendova · ‎12-14-2017

Hi Brenden,

Subcontracting is allowed on Upwork, for more information please refer to Article 8.2 RESPONSIBILITY FOR EMPLOYEES AND SUBCONTRACTORS, INCLUDING AGENCY MEMBERS in our Terms o....

The scope of the work that you are expected to do for the client should be clearly defined and mutually agreed upon, with each milestone being funded in escrow before you begin working.

Here is an article with more information regarding working Fixed-Price Contracts.

~Nina

kat303 · ‎12-14-2017

@Brenden H wrote:
Im currently workng on my first contract here on upwrk and the client im working with seems to have a freelancer account as well and is accepting work and then pushing onto other people.

A person can have both a freelancer account and a client account on this site. As long as the freelancer makes that known to the client AND the client is ok with that, then subcontracting out work is fine.

The original job posting:
**Edited for Community Guidelines**

He is treating me extremly poorly Ive done alot of work for him already and hes is being stubborn about paying milestones.

When a client starts to be very difficult and it's a big hassle for them to fund escrow, then it may be time for the freelancer to terminate the contract and move on. A freelancer (as well as a client) is not obligated to continue to work with either (client/freelancer)

The original job has a budget of 500$ but the offer I accepted from him is $1,500

He makes me remove all of my information from the title blocks and wont accept my work unless it has his name down as the author of the work.

Once a client pays for the job, the content is theirs and they can do whatever they want to with it. If you wanted your name to appear anywhere, that should have been included in the contract and agreed on by the client.

I completed half of the work now to only recieve $50.

Be VERY careful on what this client is doing. If you completed half of the work then you should have been paid half of the agreed amount - $750. And the client must fund escrow for the agreed on amount otherwise, you do NOT start work until they do. It doesn't matter what the agreed on price of this job was, you will only get paid what is in escrow.
If you do the rest of the work, and the client doesn't fund the remaining amount, then you get paid, Nothing. In this case, so far you've only received $50 but have done $750 work of work. What will you do, if you do the rest of the work and then the client disappears without paying you anything more?
Escrow is offered on this site as protection in case the above happens. At this point, the client needs to pay the remaining 1/2 amount since you've done 1/2 of the job, AND this client needs to fund the rest of the amount BEFORE you do ANY more work. If you don't follow that advice, your next post here will be " I've finished the job but I've only been paid $50. How do I get the rest of my money."
he said he cant pay me in full until I complete the other half of the work.

Should I go on?
NO, do NOT continue no matter what the client says. You need to be paid the remaining amount for the 1st milestone, AND the client needs to fund the remaining balance into escrow. Until that is done, stop working. (see above reply)

Is there any way i can contact the original job poster?
The only way you can contact the client is the way you've been contacting them before.

rendr · ‎12-14-2017

Okay and the following conversation incured

Brenden Harrison: I contacted up work customer service and they believe that I shouldn't continue working with the contract until I have been paid the 750 from the first mile stone and then the second mile stone is escrow for the rest of the contract. or if you escrow the remaining amount for the contract to the last mile stone. and I agree with them. I'm trying to run a business here and I DO NOT feel safe continuing work on this project until the funds are at least in escrow. If you are not willing do this then my business is finished here. Sorry for any inconvenience this may cause.

Ok if you dont want to move forward that is your thing. But you really want first bed feedback on Upwork? If you leave now I wont have other option...
[I am not treating or anything of course but you were wasting my time
FIRST KIOSK IS NOT DONE UNTIL WE CHEXK AND SAY THAT
So you can leave now in the middle of the project , change agreement few times and canâ€™t except good feedback probably 1... and also I will contact Upwork with all this discussion where
I waste my time waiting for you to work because you said you are .
I am not avoiding the payment or anything, I spent over 10k on Upwork and I saw that you found my business on Facebook already.
As I said I am not paying full amount until both are done . 50
Is for rev 1 and for kiosk 2 . Once when we finalize both you will get rest of it .
Also you realize that you worked and sent concepts for free , I could leave anytime and do it by myself but why would I do that if I can provide more work for you after this. Especially because we live close and we can make good partnership .

Brenden Harrison: I'm just really concerned because I've put a lot of time into this project. I take pride in my work. It's concerning that you threaten me when I'm trying to be professional and just make sure that I'm paid for the work that I'm performing. I'm not asking to be paid I'm asking to set appropriate mile stones and escrow as advised by the Upwork community.

I didnt threaten you. But what I can do if you leave in the middle of the project .
Brenden i know what is Escrow but I cant pull out the company money until project is completed .

kat303 · ‎12-14-2017

Brenden i know what is Escrow but I cant pull out the company money until project is completed

If this client knows what escrow is, then he knows it's an account where the clients money is held. You are not paid that money until the client looks over and approves the work. They have 14 days in which to do that. Funding escrow shows a freelancer "good faith" that the client is serious and professional, has the money and does intend to pay. Escrow is for both YOUR safety and the clients safety. It's there to prevent problems such as clients not paying when the job is done.

Remember, this is a stranger you met on the internet. Are you that trusting that this client will pay you once they get the job completed? They will disappear and no one, including Upwork can get them to pay you if funds are not in escrow.

If (as the above sentence states) if the client can't deposit money into escrow now, what makes you think he'll do it later.

You can tell him. " (name), I will be more then happy to continue working with you and finishing your project, but I can not do that until I am paid for the work that I've already done, which is 1/2 of the project, and until escrow is funded for the remaining balance for the rest of the project. If you feel that you do not want to pay for the work I've done and for the remaining part of this project, then it's best that you look for another freelancer more in line with how you want to work this project.

iamchunchunchun · ‎12-14-2017

Chances are that this particular client doesn't want to pay. Even if you complete the other half of the project, it would be unlikely for you to get the $1,450 you are supposed to earn. Just take a look at the feedback given by other freelancers.

I may even consider closing the contract myself if I were you... At least there could be a chance that the client 'forgets' to give the 1-star feedback.

rendr · ‎12-14-2017

Only reason I am continuing is because it says that they have spent over 10K on Upwork? Only excuse i can think of is that he will pay me once whoever hired him pays him... But Im just supposed to go on that with good faith? YEAH RIGHT.