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My proposals are archived!

Community Guru
Baris A Member Since: Mar 15, 2017
281 of 322

Virginia F wrote:

 What I wonder about is the "All Proposals" folder. Doesn't all mean all?


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Community Guru
Maria C Member Since: Jul 9, 2015
282 of 322

Actually, proposals that are sent to the end of the list (almost hidden) and labeled as "this freelancer doesn't meet the requirements" are included in the first column, and from what I've heard, I seems that an algorithm does the dirty work.

 

The day that Upworks understand the importance of having good staff to take charge of the important tasks, many things will improve. 

 

The irony is that they sell staff to other companies. 

 

 

Community Guru
Sanja D Member Since: Dec 18, 2013
283 of 322

That's really encouraging...
ok - at this point, I really see no reason to apply for jobs on Upwork - nor to pay for the membership. I have 200 connects as it is -  that itself explains a lot regarding the quality of jobs posted here. And for those few jobs I find interesting - my experience in the last 6 months is telling me that most (if not all)  of my proposals ended up in  "no-no" folder...

Community Manager
Lena E Community Manager Member Since: Apr 7, 2015
284 of 322

Hi Everyone,

We apologize for the delay, but understand we may not always be able to address posts with urgency, especially over the weekend or holidays. We understand and have read your feedback and grievances. We are glad that many of you are pleased with the Talent Services decision to no longer archive proposals. At the same time, we will not be reimbursing connects. These proposals were archived, not deleted, which means clients still had full access to all submitted proposals and were able to see the total amount of proposals listed in each section.  

 

Rest assured, archiving will not be replaced by any new process. Proposals would only appear  in the Archived list if the client or freelancer took action on the proposal. Talent Specialists will only be shortlisting proposals, as they have done. The Shortlisted list highlights proposals that Talent Specialists want to share with clients, this separate list which does not affect or touch proposals in the All Proposals list.

 

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The All Proposals tab includes all active proposals. Proposals withdrawn by freelancers or clients, and declined invites are not included in this active list, those would be found in the Archived list. The All Proposals list displays Best match as the default sorting order. However, clients can sort the proposal list as they see fit: Newest to Oldest, Highest to Lowest rate, etc. The total amount of proposals in a tab is always visible at the top alongside the navigation link.

 

 

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As for Talent Specialists in general, they will continue improving their services and training. We recognize the comments shared in the Community. Feedback about irrelevant invites is shared with their team and actioned when necessary. Obviously, we wouldn’t keep or push a program that wasn’t working or producing results. Currently, Talent Services assists with around 5% of all jobs on the platform and these jobs have a higher fill rate as well as end with high success rates and great feedback. And as mentioned before, both clients and freelancer are given an option to opt out of the service.

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Community Guru
Tiffany S Member Since: Jan 15, 2016
285 of 322

Lena E wrote:

 

At the same time, we will not be reimbursing connects. These proposals were archived, not deleted, which means clients still had full access to all submitted proposals and were able to see the total amount of proposals listed in each section.  

 

Except, of course, that we've learned in the course of this thread that at least some clients had no idea it was happening. It's a bit disingenuous to claim that no real harm was done since clients could just pop over to the archive tab when clients were given no reason to realize they had to look somewhere other than in the misleadingly-titled "all proposals."

 

 

Community Guru
Nichola L Member Since: Mar 13, 2015
286 of 322

Lena wrote:

"As for Talent Specialists in general, they will continue improving their services and training. We recognize the comments shared in the Community. Feedback about irrelevant invites is shared with their team and actioned when necessary. Obviously, we wouldn’t keep or push a program that wasn’t working or producing results. Currently, Talent Services assists with around 5% of all jobs on the platform and these jobs have a higher fill rate as well as end with high success rates and great feedback. And as mentioned before, both clients and freelancer are given an option to opt out of the service."

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 How do these Talent Specialists actually become "specialists"? What exactly is their training? There seem to be so many of them that it is unlikely they are receiving hands-on training or experience at Upwork's head office and their training can't be very lengthy either. What does it consist of - a few generic phrases and basic guidelines?

 

Now that they will no longer be archiving proposals they consider unsuitable, what will they be doing? 

 

 

 

 

 

Community Guru
Tiffany S Member Since: Jan 15, 2016
287 of 322

Nichola L wrote:

 

 How do these Talent Specialists actually become "specialists"? What exactly is their training? There seem to be so many of them that it is unlikely they are receiving hands-on training or experience at Upwork's head office and their training can't be very lengthy either. What does it consist of - a few generic phrases and basic guidelines?

 

Well, we know for sure that it doesn't consist of "send web design jobs to web designers, not writers."

Community Guru
Phyllis G Member Since: Sep 8, 2016
288 of 322

Tiffany S wrote:

Lena E wrote:

 

At the same time, we will not be reimbursing connects. These proposals were archived, not deleted, which means clients still had full access to all submitted proposals and were able to see the total amount of proposals listed in each section.  

 

Except, of course, that we've learned in the course of this thread that at least some clients had no idea it was happening. It's a bit disingenuous to claim that no real harm was done since clients could just pop over to the archive tab when clients were given no reason to realize they had to look somewhere other than in the misleadingly-titled "all proposals."

 

 


What Tiffany said, times 1,000. The only possible clue that the 'Archived' folder contains proposals that are not also present in the 'All' folder is if the number in the Archived folder is higher than the number in the 'All' folder. That might give a client pause IF they notice it, because it's counter-intuitive. But they have to notice it, first.

 

I wish UW would develop a different ethic about how to cope with unintended consequences (whether the consequence in question is that they fumbled something or that we found out about it). 

Community Guru
Janean L Member Since: Apr 6, 2016
289 of 322

Lena writes: "These proposals were archived, not deleted, which means clients still had full access to all submitted proposals..."

 

It seems to me that Upwork may be conflating the idea of "full access" with the concept of "direct access."

 

Once again, I call attention to UpWork's Terms of Service Section 2.1, in which UpWork clearly states that "Upwork... makes the Site and Site Services available to enable Freelancers and Clients to find and transact directly with each other [and that] Upwork does not... find Freelancers for Clients" and that "at all times... [u]sers are responsible for evaluating and determining the suitability of any... Freelancer on their own." 

 

Section 2.1 uses the term "directly" three separate times in describing the Freelancer-Client relationship as facilitated by Upwork.

 

True story:  When I was a teenager and a college student, I worked in my hometown library after school and during school vacations. We had variously designated sub-collections that were sometimes difficult for our patrons to locate: the "LP" (large-print) books were kept on shelves behind the mysteries; the "FOLIO" books were oversized and thus located in a special set of shelving. The "X" Collection was a set of books that contained somewhat "naughty" or sexually explicit content and that tended to "wander off" if we left them out with the general non-fiction books. We kept the "X" Collection behind the circulation desk, and anyone who held an adult library card (over the age of 13) was free to check out any book from this collection -- he or she had only to ask. Of course, some patrons didn't know that they had to ask. Some patrons didn't WANT to ask. And some patrons didn't mind asking me (a then-teenaged girl), but didn't want to ask the intimidating older ladies who worked at the circulation desk.

 

So: It could accurately be said that our library patrons had "full access" to the "X" Collection, but not "direct access" to those books.

Community Guru
Douglas Michael M Member Since: May 22, 2015
290 of 322

Lena E wrote: 

 

ATS Sort.png 

The All Proposals list displays Best match as the default sorting order.

Great. So the default sort mode for proposals is based on an Upwork matching algorithm, which is the only way they could possibly be ranked worse than by a "talent specialist." Nothing about an Upwork matching algorithm can be described as "best."

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